Harmon Solar Podcast
The solar energy sector in Arizona is currently oversaturated, which has led to a scarcity of transparency. In response, we've created a podcast to provide an honest perspective on going solar in the state. Join us as we explore the intricacies of utilities, equipment, processes, and more. Our primary objective is to educate and empower you to make informed decisions on your solar journey.
Harmon Solar Podcast
Let's Talk with Solar Detach & Reset
Tyler Hutchings, owner of Solar Detach and Reset, reveals the critical intersection of roofing and solar that most homeowners never consider until they face an expensive problem. With 15 years of industry experience, Tyler founded his specialized service after recognizing the disconnect between roofing and solar companies was creating headaches for homeowners and compromising roof integrity. Perhaps most surprising is the discussion about birds and solar systems. Pigeon nests under panels don't just create unsightly messes—they can cause serious damage. Bird debris creates dams during rainstorms that push acidic waste under tiles, eating through underlayment and accelerating roof deterioration.
Welcome to another edition of the Harman Solar Podcast. I'm Rob Fromano, vp of Sales and Marketing at Harman Solar, and with me, as always, is Ben Walschlager. Mr Everything is what we call him. Sometimes he's Mr Somethings, mr Other Things, but today he'll be Mr Everything again. Ben, how are you doing?
Speaker 1:Good, good, it's good to be back. Is it good it's good to be back on the podcast? Let's do this, get our new series here going.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a bunch of new stuff coming down the pipe. New studio coming soon, as we'll have it's going to be a whole new Harmon Solar podcast. A lot coming up. Stay tuned. New year new everything, new everything. And speaking of new everything, today we have a new guest. Yeah, we got a guy shirt yeah and I've gotten rid of all my harm and stuff because you know I don't know why.
Speaker 1:Okay, because you know.
Speaker 2:Well, actually you don't know, I don't know so and today we're going to talk um with solar detach and reset. So they're a company that we work with that does some different things that we'll get into what they do. But we thought it'd be a good idea to bring one or more of our vendors in or somebody we work with to kind of talk about what they do and how they help us in solar and what they do in the industry. So today we've got Tyler Hutchins Hutchings.
Speaker 3:There you go, from Solar Detach and Reset. What is up, gentlemen, I'm excited to be here. Yeah, the Hutchings that always gets everyone. Is there a G and an S in there?
Speaker 2:Is it I and S so?
Speaker 3:yeah, don't worry about chopping it up. And yeah, happy to be here. I'm glad, you're happy, I'm not, yeah, welcome to the show.
Speaker 1:Just so you know. If you do want to be on the podcast, you have to have a beard.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's like everyone here has a beard today. It's very important. It's a requirement. Sorry, that's what my wife says too. It's a requirement. So now are you the owner of Solar Detach and Reset five years ago and a hundred percent owner on it? Yep.
Speaker 2:Five years ago, so you've been here. Have you been in this industry that long or longer than five years? Obviously yeah.
Speaker 3:So my story goes back almost 15 years now. I started off with Sun Valley Solar Solutions, oh okay, and I've actually, through them, been recommending you guys for a long time because, in my personal opinion, harmon Solar and Sun Valley Solar are the two leaders in the local Arizona market when it comes to doing stuff right. So even early on, when I was a supervisor for them, I'd get questions all the time. You know, who do you recommend for solar? Of course, sun Valley. Well, give me one more option.
Speaker 2:You got to call Harmon too, yeah.
Speaker 3:So yeah, but yeah. So I started off installing, worked up to supervising with them and running the field teams and started getting into the service department with them. And that's where we started picking up on a big need to get all this stuff out of the way for the roofers and we we ventured off to start solar detachment reset interesting.
Speaker 2:I had no idea you were at sun valley yeah, yeah some valley.
Speaker 3:So I, I trust me, I I love you guys, I've been, I've been a big fan of Harmon for a long time. So yeah, I was working with Russ and Joe over there for about 10 years before I left and started Solar Detection.
Speaker 2:They're good guys. They're not as good as Harmon, but they're good guys. Right, right.
Speaker 1:We call them our frenemies. No, they are good guys too.
Speaker 2:So I mean I agree with you.
Speaker 3:If you're going to talk to anybody, it'd be us, it'd be them, yeah, and we can get into the whys behind that. If you want in a minute, but there's a few key things that I qualify for a solar installation company to be able to recommend them, and you guys are checking all the boxes. Sun Valley does a pretty good job with that too, so hats off to you there.
Speaker 2:I think we're going to talk about that. Let's Solar Detach and Reset. What do you guys do? People are probably going. Okay, that's an interesting name.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it actually hasn't always been called Solar Detach and Reset because my background is in operations, technical and so marketing, running a business all a big learning curve over the last five years Branding. You guys are coming from sales. You're building a great brand with this podcast.
Speaker 3:You know what's up. I've been picking up on a lot of that over the last five years and so when I started the business, we were actually called solar restore and it didn't really make much sense. I didn't know how to market. I was at home shows. I was at I was just kind of casting a wide net everywhere to try and get traction. And I remember being at home shows and people would come by at the home show and they'd be like you know forget solar, you know right. You're trying to sell me solar.
Speaker 3:I just walked by 15 guys trying to sell me solar or I already got solar, or I hate solar, whatever it is. And so I was like man, I got to switch my brand up to let people know, right, I'm not trying to sell new solar. So we switched it and pretty much put the name of what we do, the description of what we do, into the name of the business. We detach it and we reset it, yeah, and so we've been rolling a solar, detach and reset for about three years now and we've been targeting, you know, relationships with roofers since then, and so that's really our number one. It's more of a B2B marketing strategy. It's building relationships to bridge the gap between the solar and roofing industry.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so when you say you detach it, let's, let's talk about that so people might be going.
Speaker 3:So what they remove solar, yeah yeah, we always used to call them removal and reinstalls. Right, I figured I could save time with a few syllables and get a little shorter on the name, right, right um, yeah, shorter, shorter domain name, but yeah, so we detach it.
Speaker 3:Let me back up. So when I was running the service department, we started getting calls hey, can you take my solar off the roof? Well, sure, I guess we can go take it off. So we started trying to figure out how to take it off and put it back, and what we realized was there's so many different systems out there and it was messy.
Speaker 3:And there's so many different systems out there and it was messy and so we wanted to replace everything. Every time at sun valley all new racking, all new mids, all new mounts on, we pull new wire from the inverter up to the top. Oh wow, and we're we're going to charge this much a panel. I'm like we were sitting there throwing away unirack racking so that we could put iron ridge on, and anyone in the solar game knows those two are almost identical. You can buy parts for them. All the hardware is good, customers already having to panic, wrap them for the roof, and now we're adding extra cost because we can't reuse stuff. So I was like man, if we can just figure out how to put a plan on what is reusable and what's not and and try and save some money for the customer but also build a relationship with the roofers to provide a better experience to the customer.
Speaker 3:Because one of the other things I noticed in that service department at Sun Valley is it wasn't Sun Valley's number one priority, right? They wanted to sell solar, new solar, and so there just seemed to be occasional scheduling issues, like all these different roofers. Like we'd show up, roofers are still on site, or you know roofers coming in behind and saying, hey man, were you going to replace these broken tile? Oh yeah, we were. You know it's on our plan. You got to let me know. Like communication breakdowns, there's a lot of roofers in the state and they weren't a thousand registered Right and so to start building relationships with them.
Speaker 3:I'm sure you guys know Sun Valley also has a sister roofing company, azul Roofing, and so I really started talking to the guy that was running Azul. He now owns Eco Roofing Solutions, a gentleman named Eric Perry. Hey, how do you want these mounts sealed up? Like, are we doing it right? How do you want to be communicated with? What are your guys' needs? And I started figuring out that roofers really hate solar guys and I'm like, okay, it makes sense, like these guys been around since homes have been being built here come all these electricians, yeah putting holes in my roof, breaking tile, not communicating, not taking the blame if there's a problem.
Speaker 3:And so, man, how do I start building some trust? Because if these two industries are so close together, like what would happen if we started working closer together, what kind of experience would that be for the homeowner? And that was really the foundation of the model we were, we were after when we started solar detection reset, solar restore let's go, let's, let's take a step back for the audience.
Speaker 2:So, um, I'm sure people are sitting there going. Well, why is he taking solar panels off a roof? Right, right, what's the purpose of that? So you do you want to talk?
Speaker 1:yeah, so we were talking about roofing. So the the obvious is you take the panels off the roof for roofing, but you know why does it need to be re-roofed? Or are there other reasons why you take modules off a roof? Yeah, you know, besides roofing.
Speaker 3:Great, great question. So yes, occasionally. Most of the time it's for roofing issues. So, the primary roof here in Arizona is a concrete tile roof, so most of our customers probably have some type of concrete tile up on the roof. Looking at these pictures behind me, it's just a sea of concrete tile roofs, right. And so a lot of customers or homeowners don't understand that there's an underlayment underneath that tile and they see the tile and then that's going to last longer than me it's a piece of concrete.
Speaker 1:Yeah, roofs in good shape, we're good yeah.
Speaker 3:But the truth is, and what people oftentimes find and learn the hard way, is that a lifespan of a roof is 25 years on that underlayment especially if it was a tract house, new build, the type of material they were using you're going to get about 25 years on that underlayment, which is a piece of paper underneath the tile that actually keeps the water out of the home. Concrete tile is going to shed 80, 90% of the water, but it's not 100% waterproof and so when that underlayment dries out, it begins to crack and get brittle and it allows water into the roof. So that's one thing that can cause a new roof or roof replacement. The other thing that can cause it is there are a lot of people out there that leave broken tile when they install some solar or don't seal up mounts correctly or cause damage to that roof, and so what starts to happen is we take a 25 year old roof and now that solar slope maybe the lifespan got cut in half on that roof underlayment because there was some broken tile that was allowing debris and water in long-term and it expedited the lifespan. I'm sorry. The roof got shortened up from 25, now it's maybe 15. So we detached some systems that have been installed one year. We detached some systems that have been installed 25 years, and so it's always a shame if someone just put solar up right and no one explained that roof condition on the front end and now they have to incur this extra cost.
Speaker 3:But essentially, to get back to your question, yeah, it's. Someone looks up after a big rainstorm and they notice a water spot on their ceiling and they call a roofer and the roofer goes out and says, hey, you got a bad underlayment, but all those panels are in my way. And they can either say, hey, go find someone to get them out of the way, get with your original installer or Google someone. Or they can say, hey, I got this guy that I know like and I trust. Uh, because we've been working with him, I know he's not gonna break tile on your roof, he's gonna seal mounts up. Let me have him come out and get you some options on getting the solar out and we come in as a team so the roofer won't touch it.
Speaker 1:The modules, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, do you really want a roofer touching your? Probably, not, probably, not, probably not?
Speaker 3:yeah, and there's also some legality to it. Right, there's license classifications, so we want to. I've got a cr 11, which is a commercial residential electrical license. I'm sure you guys have something similar on your end installing solar. Um, yeah, these roofers are subbing out the roof work, oftentimes to a sub crew, and these guys are just swapping underlayments all day long so if you threw them a curveball to try and wire something up.
Speaker 3:It's going to void the warranty on anything and usually we're going to void a warranty if there's one still intact too, and we can get into that in a minute if you want and what happens with that but yeah, they're not going to be able to get it back up and operating and functional every single time like we are so watching this at home.
Speaker 2:I want you for a second. So we talked about this, we've done our roofing podcast and we've gone over this. If your roof is 20 years old, um, probably want to do something with it before you put solar on it, right, it's a valid point. You're saying you're seeing stuff that's one year and now all of a sudden, it needs a re-roof. I mean, the incurred cost that you're going to have for that is kind of ridiculous yeah, because your services aren't free, right, right.
Speaker 3:What yeah so?
Speaker 1:it's one of those things. If you have the modules on your roof and you have to take them off and put them back because you have to re-roof, that's at a cost. That's not a cost that you want.
Speaker 3:So let's get the roofing done first, it's a good cost too, yeah, but it's usually not a cost that's discussed when the solar is sold. I know you guys are but most people they want to sell the solar and it's a shame because there's an opportunity to sell a roof and solar together and have some additional benefits there.
Speaker 2:We talk about this. We've talked about roof condition and solar. We've talked about it until we beat the dead horse right. One of the things we talk about at Harman is we put a 30-year roof penetration warranty on your system. Now that is three inches around the penetration for the rails of your solar system. That's it. It's just a three inches. It's not saying that your whole roof is warrantied, just the holes that we're making in three inches around them. Now we're not going to go ahead and put solar on a roof that we feel is not going to hit that 30 years. We feel confident that we're going to make that warranty, but most people out there um and we can talk about that don't care. It's about selling you the system, getting it on your roof and getting the commission in their pocket that's it they're done there are certain installers that are not around anymore.
Speaker 2:I could think of one behemoth and we all know who that is that would install on any roof they didn't, a roof could be bowed they didn't care, they were never going to put it on that roof because they were going to get that system done and get paid for it. Yeah, and that's where harmon and then a couple other guys are different, where we just won't do that?
Speaker 1:yeah, we can't do that. We'll walk away from a deal, you know we have walked away.
Speaker 3:That's what you have to be willing to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we take a look at a roof in a situation hey, we're not gonna put modules on this roof unless you replace it. You know, we'll give you a quote for it and everything. And the homeowner's like no, just put it on there. Nope, we won't do it.
Speaker 2:They said they'll do it. I remember a specific customer on there. Forget this, the exact scenario. We walked away. We said we're not doing it. They said, well, they'll say they do it, they're going to do it. So they went ahead and had it done with them. They gave us a bad review online. They started having leaks and issues. Did they call us to fix?
Speaker 1:it? Oh no, yeah, they did.
Speaker 2:They called us and we're like we told you I hate to say it we said it for a reason and now they had to pay all this expense to get this thing fixed we should have an.
Speaker 1:I told you so, department, we do. It's your phone number. It's my number.
Speaker 2:No, it is but it's it's so critical when you say that I'm like, I'm like I'm thinking of my own house, like I, I have hip and ridge seals. Yeah, I put on there just to make sure that I don't have a lot of that leakage issue.
Speaker 3:So a lot of people don't know what that is.
Speaker 2:We've talked about that in a roofing podcast too. It's just basically like a gasket seal on the hips and the ridges that doesn't allow water to get underneath the concrete stuff and hit the underlayment.
Speaker 3:Yeah, to break it down even farther. You guys, you said 10 years old, 15 years old. What do you look for like? What's that cap for?
Speaker 2:you guys, when you're like, is it just based off the looking at that lap and actually inspecting the other thing, we're looking at the condition, yeah and, and that's the best way because some people don't have a true way. Some people buy a house five years ago they didn't know that it was in. It was re-roofed maybe two years before that and they have no idea. Maybe it's in really good condition, yeah but some been sitting there for 20 years in the phoenix heat and we know what.
Speaker 3:So if the lifespan of a roof is 25 years, what would you guys say?
Speaker 1:the lifespan of a solar system typically is Solar hasn't been around as long as roofs, but Right, but they have 25-year warranties, 25-year warranties.
Speaker 3:So we have both. These things have the same lifespan. So if we can start the lifespans together and replace them at the same time.
Speaker 3:That's in the best interest. I had one guy who had a 10-year-old roof, put solar on. That solar lasted him I think he called me 10, 12 years after he had the solar installed. So now the roof is 22 years old. Solar had paid for itself and been a net positive for this guy for a few years. But he still needed to pay for a detachment and reset at year 10, which pretty much sucked up all of his savings into paying for that detachment, reset and the new roof. And he's starting over again now with 12-year-old panels getting reinstalled onto his roof. So we try and upgrade the panels but really starting these things together at the same time ensures they're going to. They're going to die together.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah. What would you say? And I've heard people say this before, so let's, let's get your opinion. Um, people try to sell the. They sell the fact that if you have solar on your roof, it actually enhances the lifetime, the life of your roof. It makes it last longer because you have panels up there, so it's deflecting the heat. You're not having the same beating that you would have if you didn't have it. What do you think about that statement? Because people make that statement.
Speaker 3:Um, I'd say not true for tile roofs. Uh, because it's not affect the tie, the tiles already shading the underlayment. Um on a shingle roof. Um, I you're going to see a little bit Some shingle roofs you go on that are north and south facing roofs. The north side roof is really good condition and the south roof looks like crap.
Speaker 2:Why.
Speaker 3:Because it's taking the beating on that sun. So there is something to that. So on a shingle roof you pull the panels, we're going to see better condition directly underneath the panels for the shingles. However, all around the perimeter of those panels it's still been hitting sun and so if you're still taking damage outside the perimeter of that solar panel array, you know you're not going to just go patch and redo the roof around the solar. You're going to do the whole slope anyways, right?
Speaker 1:yeah, right. So so take us through that process of what you guys do, like you know yeah, it's probably not cut and dry of just I'll just come up there and unscrew some things and throw some panels on the ground, just high level, like what goes through you guys' process of taking them off, obviously in the roofing aspect, and then putting them back on.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I think one thing that's key to us is we have a project coordinator on every job. That's managing communications between the homeowner and the roofer and ensuring everything's going smooth, and so setting expectations on the front end about where would you like these stored in your garage, in your backyard, putting a plan in place, letting them know of any material that needs to be replaced on the front end, making sure there's not going to be change orders, so getting a good plan. After that plan's in place, we will schedule very closely with the roofers to minimize downtime for the solar. So how long do you need for the roof? We'll come in a day or two before. We'll come in a day or two after. We'll make sure this thing is scheduled nice and tight so the solar is not down, especially during the summer.
Speaker 3:It's a big concern for the homeowner, and, and so after we get the schedule, we're pulling everything off. First thing we're going to do is a performance verification and system inspection with lots of pictures and to document everything. If there's an issue on this job, we don't want to get blamed for it. We want to be the one providing solutions on the front end. Hey, this is a code compliant issue we noticed as we're pulling it off, let's show the homeowner, let's talk about it as soon as possible so we'll make sure the system's working properly. If it is a leased system, we will get a third party agreement with that leasing company. Make sure there's additional paperwork filled out, certificates of insurance, whatever needs to be done to make sure everything's legit for Sunrun, tesla, solarcity systems, things like that.
Speaker 3:So after we start, we do the performance verification, we, we, we document everything really well. So, exact location of the panels on the roof, so they're going back in the exact same spot, um, where all the home runs out. We're going to make a custom string diagram where we build out location of J boxes, jumper wires, all the wiring schematics, um, and then we are going to organize everything that comes off, so all the the certain types of clamps will go in one bucket and other types of clamps, t-bolts, in another bucket. Um, and so it's. It's super clean and organized and we we know um what we need to bring out next time if anything does need to be replaced. Um, when we pull the mounts, we we put some some sealant down where we yank that mount out, even though the roofer is coming in a day or two later. It might monsoon, right we might pop up shower.
Speaker 3:So sealing that roof well, where we yank the mount out, is important. And then communicating with the roofer, getting everything stored where the customer wants it, nice and clean and organized. Um, allowing the roofer getting everything stored where the customer wants it, nice and clean and organized, allowing the roofer to come do their job. Now, through this process, we're checking in with the roofer and the homeowner hey, is that roof done? When he said it's going to be done, how is our crew doing? Some outbound calls Make sure everything's going smooth from that project coordinator. Then once we confirm roof complete, we're on track for that reset. We'll go out. Uh, typically get a new mountain there's. Usually the mounts are getting replaced because there's too much sealant or it's a bad type of mount that we want to reuse and we're sealing it back up um, better than before. Usually you guys seal your mounts well. I've seen your house, but you know how most people are sealing them out there.
Speaker 3:So that's what we find, um, and so we're upgrading that.
Speaker 2:You know we're giving them a bottom flashing and putting some more stuff on these mounds to give them peace of mind when you, when you run into a job that someone used a tile hook on, yeah, do you go back to the tile hook or do you do something different?
Speaker 3:Uh, you know. So the thing we want to filter through is is this okay with the roofer, is this okay with the homeowner, is it secure? And is it secure and is it sealed, and you know? And so a tile hook does check those boxes. The downside to the tile hook is, um, it hooks out from underneath the tile and it can pop tile up slightly. And so if if you have the wrong type of tile hook or a tile's not sitting well on it, you might just shave those tiles down, make sure it's proper and we're not popping tile up. The tile replacement system is nice because you get extra tile on the roof that you can use to swap out any broken tile with. So it can be smooth, even though it's a little bit more of a I don't want to say pain to install. There's a learning curve. It might be an adjustment, but it's still not as fast as the tile hook. So I'm not opposed to the tile hook.
Speaker 2:So you're putting it back to what it was, but trying to make it even better than it was, if you can. It's all about this. Way it's sealed, yeah yeah it's all about what, how.
Speaker 3:What are you doing where those holes are going through the roof, whether it's a tile hook or a tile replacement? How?
Speaker 2:long. I know there's gonna be different sizes and different systems, but a typical, let's say a 10k system, how long does it take you guys to do your process? I mean just your process? I know the roofer has to do their work, but what do you? How long does it take you?
Speaker 3:yeah, I mean we're, we can detach. One crew can detach up to 70 80 panels in a day and you know if we're resetting. There's a lot of variables. Right, two-story, multi-array, right, isn't one of those solar city tesla jobs that take a little?
Speaker 2:bit longer, because there's a skirt and some.
Speaker 3:So of course there's factors, but typically 30 to 40 panels on a reset and and in a day. So we go above that 30 to 40 mark. It'd become a two day at that point okay okay, yeah, so you figure that again they're about.
Speaker 1:There are two to three days in roofer is going to take however long they take, so this could be a weak process I feel like the putting it back is probably one of the most crucial aspects, because the last thing that you want is a homeowner going. You know, know, if some issue comes up and well, they're the ones that put it back, and this is so. Obviously you're probably meticulous with taking it off, but putting all the modules and everything back is probably, I would say, even more crucial, because that's like your stamp on the job, like this is not only back the way it was, but it's a little bit better.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean we give a new workmanship warranty on every nut bolt or electrical connection that we touch.
Speaker 3:We offer a two, five or 10 year option on that workmanship. So if someone's out of their warranty they can get put back into a new warranty with us at the time of detached reset. Or maybe they have two years left on their existing, we'll extend it up to 10. But we also give 100 money back no leak guarantee. So you're talking about three inch radius on all your mounts. Yeah, that's what's warranty. If any of my mounts leak within that three inches, I'm going to refund them every penny for the solar detach and reset, because I'm selling peace of mind right, I'm selling peace of mind.
Speaker 3:I'm so confident my ceiling, I haven't had to do it once that was gonna be my next question how long is that warranty?
Speaker 2:it's two, five or ten years?
Speaker 3:that's two, five or ten also yeah, wow, and so it's because, when, when, when someone's calling me, they're not thinking about getting new solar. It's not a want, it's like man. This thing is unexpected neat, there's water coming in my house. Sure they want peace of mind that these a couple hundred holes that are going back again are going to be solid and they're never gonna have to worry about this, this 20, 30 000 roof and this detach and reset for a long time to come I would think the downside may be um, let's say somebody has a system installed and it's been installed for two, three years, right, and they need and they need this service.
Speaker 2:Um, like for instance at harman right, we provide that service as well. We do remove and reinstalls as well. We do the same thing you do, um, so we, but it's our work, so we warrant, we continue to warranty our work. I'm assuming let's say there's a company that puts their system up and then two years later it needs an issue. They go to you. That would that impact. It could impact the warranties they're getting from that solar company. Yeah, their workmanship, their leak warranty, that all probably goes away.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like if you guys install the system I don't want to use you guys as a bad example, but if another company installed a, system and two years goes by and they need a detach and reset and that company never explained that this was a thing oh bad on them, right because they didn't look at like going back to not looking at the roof.
Speaker 3:Right, right man, you didn't tell me about that. And then a roofer goes and looks at it and they're like you got got like seven broken tile under those panels. Just so you know too, they're not going to, they don't trust that company anymore, Right and so trust. They're going to go looking for someone else and that roofer is going to recommend us, and so we are going to void a warranty, if it is existing.
Speaker 2:And that's why we offer a new one. That's good that you do that because I know if it was a Harmon job, we warranty for 30 years If someone else were to go in there and touch it obviously that voids all that warranty, yeah.
Speaker 3:Cause I'm going to loosen up everything.
Speaker 2:We have a 25 year workmanship warranty, a 30 year penetration warranty, that would be gone. Yeah, you would pick that up, which I think that's great that you do that, cause I bet you there's companies out there that don't do that.
Speaker 3:Yeah there's definitely a lot of companies that don't do it and, as you guys know, you talked about some behemoths out there in the industry that aren't around anymore, like these companies that are going out of business left and right. They need homes for someone to help service this stuff.
Speaker 2:You know to that point. So this is a really good thing to take away from, just if you're going to lose all your warranties.
Speaker 1:They're gone.
Speaker 2:Right. Another way to lose them is by your serial installer going out of business. Yeah, and there's a stat out there that I talked about last week from 2022, the top 10 installers in the country, they're all out of business. All 10 from 2022. That's insane. Yeah, right of business. All 10 from 2022. That's insane, right. But that's what this industry has gone through. And then us that are left standing are, for there's a reason. We're left standing, right, it's how we do business, it's what we do. We're not going anywhere.
Speaker 3:Right and that's and that and that's huge. But you have to overcome a potential trust issue with the homeowner that sees all these companies going out of business. You have to build trust that you're not like them.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and and, and we do that similarly by, by positioning ourselves as like, like we're not trying to sell new solar. You know we're different. We were here to service all the solar already installed. You know, on the back end here.
Speaker 2:It's important and we talk about this all the time it's important to make sure the company's been around. Do you do diligence on the company? This is our 50th year at Harman. Right, we're doing our 50-year anniversary this year. That's a big accomplishment that we've been around for 50 years four generations of Harman.
Speaker 3:It's not a coincidence. It's not a coincidence that the companies around are doing things the right way.
Speaker 2:When it got really bad two, three years ago and everybody was dropping like flies, I mean we were still fine, we're fine. It's not an issue, right. We just keep going because we're so diversified. We've talked about this as well. We do so many different things. We're not just in one part of the business.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so we as a company have lasted longer than our warranties that we offer. Yes.
Speaker 3:That's important. I wonder how many people can say that yeah, and we put that tagline out there, right?
Speaker 2:You should check and see is the company the company? They haven't we offer a two month warranty?
Speaker 3:Yeah Well, there's you talk about like the I almost want to call it like the warranty race that happened.
Speaker 2:It happened in the roofing industry too. It's happening.
Speaker 3:Now it happened. It's oh, I got a 10. Now the next guy's got a 12. Then we got a 15. Now we got a 20. Now we got a 30 and someone's going to come out. But so to that's great. Someone comes in with some lifetime or 50 year and you have to really get them to understand. What does this truly mean? How long have they been around?
Speaker 2:What does that think of a big installer that had a lifetime their life?
Speaker 1:is over. It's their lifetime. The warranty is of their lifetime, not your life.
Speaker 2:That's exactly it. You get this man. It doesn't.
Speaker 3:It's not worth the paper, it's on right, you got to look at the company, so worth the paper it's on. Right, you gotta look at the company, but you gotta, you gotta explain this to the, to these customers. Right, as you're going up against these guys, I'm sure all the time.
Speaker 2:So one of the things that we partner with with you is so. This is important too. So I'm going to give the example right in my house, I have solar on my house, I have a 10k system, and I live in a neighborhood that has a lot of darn pigeons in it yeah, you do.
Speaker 2:There's, there's a ton of pigeons out here, and I didn't have any protection from that for my system for the first two months because of whatever reason I don't even remember what it was, but I had pigeons nesting under my system. I had bird crud all over my sidewalk. It was ridiculous. And so we, as a company, we used to do a lot ourselves. We installed bird proofing or whatever you want to call it, and I don't have the issue anymore, and it's been 10 years. That finger, whatever you want to call it, and I don't have the issue anymore, and it's been 10 years. You, that's what we partner with, you, you guys, actually do all of that for us right now, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:So when I left Sun Valley I asked Russ. I was like, hey man, you know the only way I can pick up all your bird guard contracts just to help me get the ball rolling with this new business. And he's like yeah, we'll start using you guys for all our all, our all, our bird guard, and so we were getting some jobs from that, you know.
Speaker 3:And I was like man I really like harman, I'm gonna go stop in over there and I believe uh talk to uh brad yep and uh, I talked to brad and and kind of dropped off my card and some information, told him I did bird guard, seeing if I can get in with you guys. And he called me about a month later. He's like hey, you know the guys were using something happened. I won't't get into it, but something happened. We're looking, wondering if we can meet down, sit and talk. And so I went and sat down with Brad and I was like, hey, yeah, let's, we went and finished that job. They couldn't finish it.
Speaker 3:And since then we've been working with you guys to install bird guard on a lot of your new systems and you know, I know you guys have a solid service department. So even on some customers who are calling in who already have the bird issue, like you did, we'll go clean all that debris off the roof. It's important to get it out from underneath the panels before installing the bird guard talk about that so what?
Speaker 2:what problems can birds and critters cause for a solar system? What?
Speaker 3:do you run into? Yeah, who cares of the nest right?
Speaker 1:yeah, I do well. Yeah, it's like, why ty you?
Speaker 3:do solar detach and reset? Why even mess with bird guard? And it's it. Yeah, it's like why, ty, you do solar detach and reset? Why even mess with bird guard? And it's a needed service. But also it's causing roofing issues, the birds. It's taking away from peace of mind for the customer. Right, you got poop coming off the roof into your yard. You can't go barbecue and walk barefoot back there.
Speaker 2:You're worried about the dog getting in. It's all in one spot usually right. Yeah, it's all in one spot usually right. Yeah, it's bad.
Speaker 3:So you're losing peace at your home. But also when debris gets underneath the panels, the bird debris and they start building nests. Those nests will dam up water during heavy rains. And that dam will push water uphill under the tile. When it does that, it takes bird debris with it. Now you have wet bird debris sitting on that underlayment and the poop, the bird debris, is acidic and so that moisture of that acidic poop will eat through the underlayment and cause a roof leak and the need for a detachment reset.
Speaker 1:Really good. Wow yeah, didn't even think about that yeah, I knew nesting under there was a problem. But then the like oh yeah, when it rains it forms a dam and water and this. And I'm like, oh, that's a big problem now.
Speaker 3:I didn't even think, yeah that's crazy so if we look at it from that perspective, these birds, if you don't take care of them, can cost a lot of money, yeah, and cost of a new roof and a detached reset. That maybe isn't needed quite yet, but you expedited, you expedited the lifespan of that roof again now, from a-year roof to now a 15, 10, because birds are chilling out there.
Speaker 2:So tell us what you do to fix that problem. What do you go up there and do?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I know you clean it, yeah, so if you got to, depending on how bad it is. Sometimes we have to get the panels out of the way to do a thorough clean out, and it's important to get all of the debris out, because pigeons there's a pheromone in their debris, they're a homing pigeon, so they will return to the scent of their poop, essentially, and won't leave the house. So we have some customers that have a clean out done or bird guard installed and they don't do a clean out. You leave a lot of stuff under the panels. The pigeons poop all over the panels and circle the panels and still stay at the house and they're still trying to get in. So you got to clear everything off the roof.
Speaker 3:Um, so what we do is we get on the top side of the panels, we push everything out with water and these long plastic PVC sticks and we work it all out until there's no debris underneath. Now where's it all going? We don't want it going in the rocks or the artificial grass or in the AC unit, and so the whole landscape downstairs has to be protected with a. We put a landscape fabric down so it'll catch all that debris. That way we can roll it, bag it, take it away and then, after the clean-out's done, we install a steel material. It's been dipped with a black PVC coating so it matches the panel frame. It goes all the way around the perimeter of the panels.
Speaker 3:We don't void any warranties on the panels because we use a hook to hook the panels, not a screw to go into the frame of the panels. Nice, yeah, um. So it's super clean, doesn't void any warranties. We give a no bird guarantee, um on all those systems. So if something happens, a bird does make it past our stuff, we'll come, of course, address it and fix it um and get it, get it, get it dialed in um.
Speaker 3:But even after we install BirdGuard, it's going to take a couple weeks for those birds to leave because, again, they're going to circle those panels and look for those nests and look for their home, and then eventually they're going to go okay, it's too hot and I need some shade and they're going to look at your neighbor's house and they're going to head over there and they're going to go to what they know which is back underneath some more panels.
Speaker 1:That's the best referral right there.
Speaker 3:Well, and they're multiplying. The pigeon problem as a whole is increasing over time.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Because they don't migrate, they stay here year round and they multiply like rabbits, and so, and there's not enough hawks, there's not enough. You know, look at New York City. Like you know, that's the direction we're going. When it comes to like the birds, um, uh, getting worse as the population grows, and so if we know it's getting worse over time, uh, we, we really recommend getting bird guard installed, or at least educating the customer on things to look out for, so we can catch it early.
Speaker 2:I will be. I will tell you it absolutely works. Um, I had the issue. It solved my problem. I don't have the issue at all and it's been years. So the don't have the issue at all and it's been years. So the stuff makes a ton of sense. It's not, it's not just a bunch of bs, it's real. It absolutely works and if you need to take a look at your neighborhood, you see pigeons. Do this, do it, yeah, yeah, do it up front when you buy this system. Just get it. It's not a big ad. Get it done and be done with it. I know you're doing all of ours right now, I believe yeah, and, like you said, it's not that expensive.
Speaker 3:it's expensive, it's a cheap insurance policy.
Speaker 1:It's a lot cheaper than removing your panels and doing the roof again, versus just do the bird guard.
Speaker 3:Yeah, because we will charge extra if we have to clean out bird debris and so that's an extra time, extra work and it's a messy job. The cheapest time to do it is just when you get the solar, just tack it on. I'd say if you are in a suburban area, tract, home area, anywhere in the Phoenix Metro, just get it installed. If you have a S tile or W tile roof, especially flat tile roof, there's a little more airflow. You still want to keep an eye on it. It can happen. But I'd say, if you've got a shingle or roof or if you're on the outskirts of town, the hawk population is maybe a little thicker. Keep, just keep an eye on it. You might not need to pull the trigger right away, but you definitely want to know signs to look for.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've seen it on the commercial side as well. Um, like you know those parking canopies and you have a lot of birds will nest on, like the columns, and you see that, you know they're right by the home runs and everything. So obviously those birds sometimes, will you know, disconnect a wire here or there or you know, mess with things. Do you guys do stuff on the commercial side?
Speaker 3:yeah, yeah, yeah, we've done a few large commercial projects where we're running, instead of like, a metal screen around the perimeter of panels, maybe it's a uv rated mesh that is like a hundred by hundred section that we're putting up and attaching skin tight underneath or above a surface. Um, we did a big detachment reset for boys and girls club over the last year and it was one of the worst bird problems I've ever seen. There was probably two to three hundred birds, I'd say just flying they were swarming around us.
Speaker 3:You know, as we're doing the detach and so getting all that debris off was just a quite a job in itself. But afterward this this was just a ballast tilt system with probably two 300 panels on like a gymnasium. Right, how do you bird guard that? It's not easy. So we have to like go over the top of this entire 150 foot by 200 foot roof and secure to the perimeter with a cable and stretch it and then support it above the arrays. And I'm like man, this is kind of shading the panels, but if we don't do it like it's going to mess.
Speaker 2:So you went over the entire array.
Speaker 3:Yeah, because usually with the net, oh, you want to use an exclusion method and you're going underneath it right um, but this one, the way that it was set up, this ballast, there was no way, there was no way to work in between all the ballasts of of the blocks. It was the way, way it was tight and the jaggedness of it, and so we offered it to as a solution for this guy. We're like, hey, we can go over the top of this whole thing and that's really all we're willing to do in order to ensure birds don't get back in on this roof. And they pulled the trigger on that. What a big cage.
Speaker 2:I gotta say that's interesting. I've never seen.
Speaker 3:Three to five feet in areas above where the panels are, because it was attached to the parapet wall and supported above. So you're going to get little shade spots from that net and we explained all this to the customer on the front end, of course, of the risk of that side. But the risk of the birds getting back in was heavier.
Speaker 2:I'm sure it impacted a little bit.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Really small though. Yeah, because of the shade. Yeah, that's interesting.
Speaker 3:I've never heard that. Yeah, I mean we're talking. It's like a. It's like an inch and a half square holes with really small like uv rated nylon that we're talking here in terms of the material.
Speaker 1:So do you come across like other pests besides? Bird like cats or like a bee's nest wasp nest. We were on the I got.
Speaker 3:So I got a picture from one of my field guys a couple months ago. Um, there was a we we've seen raccoons foxes cats. Yeah, an actual fox.
Speaker 2:A fox in town.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, guy got a video of a fox running out of the panels and taking off on the roof you know, fox proof your solar system.
Speaker 1:Wow, call Harmon for a quote.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah yeah, I mean, I think there's even there's a guy out there right now that has a a few hawks that he's trained and he'll go out.
Speaker 2:oh nice, and he's taught them to catch these pigeons too, so can we add that look for him on social media, bring him in here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the harvard hawks he drives.
Speaker 3:He drives around, yeah, in his car with the window down oh, I've seen him.
Speaker 1:I've seen him, the hops go out and sick inside of him.
Speaker 3:That's crazy, come on, yeah, I want to pay just to see it.
Speaker 2:I don't know if it works or not, but yeah, I'd like to see a hawk come and kill a bird. I've seen more hawks here lately all of a sudden? Yeah, because I guess there's agging out pigeons and dropping them and eating them. There you go, and I was like wow, this is kind of crazy because the population has gotten so bad.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, you know the job security for you, though right it is.
Speaker 3:You know, the worst case scenarios when it comes to bird debris really comes from neglect from the homeowner. Yeah like you did the right thing by noticing, calling having something done. People will just live with the. Let it get to the point where I mean it's.
Speaker 3:It's bird debris from the tile all the way up to the underside of the panel so we're talking eight inches thick under the entire array, and so it's shoveling, it's moving all the panels all the way and it's shoveling the stuff into buckets right. And so we got, we got full, we got masks, we got eye protection, we got, and it's 120 out. It's just a nasty, dirty job, man.
Speaker 2:Do you guys ever work with insurance companies? I know you do the R and R's and stuff and then do you ever work with insurance companies to kind of you know? I know that some of them will. Actually, if the roof's in bad shape for whatever reason, if there's damage for hail or whatever, they'll actually pay for it. Yeah Right, so have you guys done?
Speaker 3:insurance work? Yeah, absolutely so. The roofer that specializes in insurance is usually a little bit different model, different animal than a retail roofer. We serve both of them. The insurance companies do pay for the detach and reset if they're paying for the roof. Insurance companies do pay for the detach and reset if they're paying for the roof, and so that's good that they are paying to get it out of the way for these customers. So we will do some insurance work. There's some variables to it in terms of what that customer that's filing an insurance claim.
Speaker 3:Right. They're usually paying maybe $1,000 deductible deductible right, and so just getting it done quick and easy. A thousand bucks it's. It's a. It's not selling off value as much in terms of, uh, the guarantees and the warranties, it's just it's. It's a fast moving thing when those guys are door knocking and pushing, detach and reset while they're doing it. But yeah, absolutely we'll work with with any insurance company out there, okay nice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's. That's good. Yeah, it's a peace of mind for that homeowner peace of mind, but it's got to be it's.
Speaker 3:It's only for a shingle roof though. So if you've got a tile roof, it's going to be really hard to file a claim on that, because you know their insurance is only going to approve it if it's storm damage. If it's natural wear and tear, they're not going to approve it, and it's hard to get storm damage on a tile roof. The only time you're going to file a claim is if you had a microburst that came and pulled tile physically off your roof and exposed that underlayment and allowed the underlayment to be damaged. You might have a shot then, but you ever run into any system?
Speaker 2:I'm sure you have you ever run into any systems where they're just the installation is just, I want to say, wrong, oh yeah, just, and you have to put it back the way it was. You run into a bad installation. There's a lot of bad installments, oh yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's so many man. I mean, what do you do? We've got some bad, bad stories out there.
Speaker 2:I'm just curious, like what's your process If you run into just one of those situations? What do you do? I mean, you've got as well as inform the customer.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So it's all about communicating on the front end, like we want to be sympathetic to the customer in that situation, but we want to be the hero in that situation. We want to be coming down with photos of everything and explaining any risks of the bad install that might be up there and then saying, hey, this isn't how we're going to put it back. This is how we're going to put it back, and it's either we're going to do that at no cost that's an easy fix or man, they've like free aired this THHN wire all the way through your attic and no conduit, and I cannot put my name on this.
Speaker 3:You have to get this in a pipe to be code compliant right.
Speaker 1:So is it?
Speaker 3:a code compliant issue, or is it maybe like they forgot a couple end clamps and ground lugs and something like that? But we've seen. I mean I've got a lot of stories of weird, bad, nasty stuff like panels being held down with like copper ground wire going through the panel and wrapped around the rail right for an end, Because it looks like they didn't have enough material or something right.
Speaker 1:We'll make it work yeah.
Speaker 3:But then the thing is is a lot of this stuff is. I can't believe how long it actually is sitting up there like that, and sometimes it'll blow off. You know, we get a call, hey, there's panels in my yard, but yeah, some of the stuff I get up there and I just cannot believe.
Speaker 3:The biggest thing that shocks me, though, is just the lack of care of the sealing process on those mounts yeah and and I don't know how they're getting away with just some gunk out of a caulking tube underneath the base plate and walking away from it. It just seems like there's too much risk there to not put some type of housing over where those lag bolts are going on.
Speaker 2:Well, they just don't care. I mean they're going to do it as cheap as possible. It's time and material. Yeah, I mean, the cheaper they can do it, the more money they can put in their pockets. So that's how they. Harmon's not the cheapest option out there. It's just we can't be. I mean we got to do it the right way because we're going to warrant it 30 years or whatever we're warranting. You get what?
Speaker 1:you pay for Right.
Speaker 2:We talk about that all the time. I mean, you get what you pay for, so you can work with a quality company like you guys or us or yeah, there's a lot of other guys you can work with that a quality company.
Speaker 3:for me, it's what's their sealant process looks like? Yeah, what, what? Do they have a service department in-house?
Speaker 3:are they servicing the start to finish where they're selling it, installing it and servicing it, um, and it's not like, uh, I know you guys said you work with some outside sales reps, and I'm sure we do, you know, but there's got them as well. A lot of times to the homeowner. They get an outside sales rep and they don't even know who's doing the install yeah, you know so, um, that that's key, uh, but then also, what's their communication?
Speaker 3:and have they stayed the test of time? Yeah, and if we check those three boxes, like you guys have, you're on the right track, you know no, I agree.
Speaker 2:I mean, like we do work with sales companies. There's a lot of sales companies out there that go and sell solar, knock door-to-door and stuff and, like you're, they use whoever they can get that's going to do it really cheap, right, that may be there today might not even be in the state. We see a lot of that as well. So we do a good job of vetting who we use and we make it a point of you need to make sure we have all the customer communication once a job's sold, because we want them to know who they're dealing with. Now they are our customer. They may have bought the system from somebody else, but really they're our customer.
Speaker 1:I like asking worst case scenarios. When I vet out a company, I'll ask you I guess you have a system on a two-story home. Obviously you're getting up there removing panels. As a homeowner, I'm thinking I got this guy taking my modules down this ladder. What happens if something breaks? What is your process? What do you do if you drop a module? Something breaks A lot of it is just how is right?
Speaker 3:yeah, you know, you want to.
Speaker 3:You just want to do right by people, and if you make a mistake, or if anyone on my team makes a mistake like I'm, going to own it every single time. And I think that's one of the main disconnects that happen between the roofing and solar industry is when a mistake would happen. It turned into a finger pointing contest, oftentimes between the solar company and the roofing company, and so my my perspective is of it is if it's my mistake, I don't care how much it costs, we're going to fix it and we're going to move on fast and we're going to get to the next job together, mr Roofer, but if it's something, where is the roofing issue? We're going to go out and look at it together and get on the same page with what actually is causing the issue and work it as a team. So I mean we've made mistakes. We've made mistakes that have cost $10,000, $15,000, $20,000 over the last year, and those are hard pills to swallow, but the truth of the matter is the relationships are worth more than that, yeah.
Speaker 2:No, we always talk about. We're a instruction company and we're going to make mistakes. It's how we react to the mistake, it's how you react, right? So as long as we take care of the mistake, then that's great. A lot of companies will run away from it, like you said, or finger point finger into their places. Yeah, we won't do that. I'm glad you don't do that. I think it's interesting because in one, in one point of it, where the bird blocking and all that stuff, you're, we're we're utilizing you we're partners, right, and it's important that we have that relationship together.
Speaker 2:But then in the other section of it, with the R and R stuff, we're kind of competitors.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right.
Speaker 2:Right, but there's a place for what you do in a place for what we do, because if you're a Harman customer, you know, know. I would say again it's a 30-year warranty and if someone else touches it, right we're out, let us take care of it, right yeah.
Speaker 2:So that's why we take, that's why we have a huge service department and we handle our business that way. But there are so many companies that are out of business. There's so much business out there for guys like you that are doing it right. I consider you like, just like harman that goes and does it the right way for people, versus you don't want any roofer or any joe blow touching your solar system right. I've seen too many situations and I'm sure you have too where the guy goes up there, touches it, doesn't know what he's doing and just destroys it I've seen it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've seen quite a few horror stories like oh my my uncle's an electrician. He can take a look at it like okay, it's not that simple.
Speaker 3:There's so many different types out there.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, no, I agree. So it's just kind of funny how you're anywhere talking about your business, but I'm your competitor of ours. Yeah, yeah, and I knew that coming into this and I love it because I one compliment to you guys is I. I see your systems the least and you should, which is a good thing, that means your customers are calling you to get it done because they still trust you and they want to maintain that, and we have.
Speaker 2:We have a thing in our, our contracts too, where we it's a benefit for our customers to come back through us yeah, because don't you guys do a little bit of roofing or work with we do?
Speaker 3:yeah, we do roofing ourselves so we have those things together so we have all that built in-house.
Speaker 2:I mean that's just how we're set up, but yeah, but there's so many of you out there that just haven't worked with Harmon or have systems outside of Harmon, especially that your guys are out of business. I mean you want to call a company like you because you're doing it right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right, you're doing it like we would do it. Yeah, it's either they're out of business or the homeowner doesn't trust them anymore. Those are our two.
Speaker 2:And it's very common to hear those two things. It's very common. That's exactly out of business or they don't trust them and those two things are continuing.
Speaker 3:If we look at the trajectory over time there, the amount of trust I believe is is decreasing just because of the bad reps. Solar's doing it's stuff like this. It's fighting back against that, right, it's talking about the right way, um, but yeah, it's uh getting out there, getting them a new warranty, getting them solutions, streamlining everything, getting a good communication it's I mean, you're validating what we talk about all the time, right?
Speaker 2:that's why we could bring a competitor on and talk about the right way to do things, because we this is about. Our podcast has always been about educating you, the customer, on how things should be done the right way. Yeah, so we'll bring a competitor on and you're also a partner of ours to talk about. Hey, we're on. We're a common ground here. We both agree, this is how you do stuff right yeah's why we do this.
Speaker 3:There is a right way to do solar. It starts with finding someone you can trust to explain the right way. Don't just take anyone off the street. Do your homework. Check for those three things I talked about. Give Harman Solar a call to get the right answers. Check out this podcast. If you're thinking about solar. That's how you get peace of mind.
Speaker 1:How can?
Speaker 3:people find you Check me Thinking about solar. That's how you get peace of mind.
Speaker 2:Well, how can people find you? So check me out. Tythesolarguy on Instagram.
Speaker 3:TyTheSolarGuy On Facebook yeah and Bridge the Gap Podcast on Spotify, apple Play.
Speaker 2:Yeah, let's push that, so you have a podcast. Bridge, the Gap yeah, so your roofing side.
Speaker 3:maybe, come on, we could talk a little bit on there one day. Yeah, we'd love to come on Okay, cool, and then yeah, solardetachprocom, if you want to check out the website.
Speaker 1:All right, all right, you guys need special promos going on discounts or anything you want to plug.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you know I won't push anyone, you know, in terms of referring roofers and those guys like we try to keep an even playing field there on that, but I'd say the one, the one tip I'll give on the way out here is get a free inspection done If you haven't had your roof looked at or your solar looked out in the last year.
Speaker 3:Call Harmon, get a free inspection done and just stay on top of it. Don't let it get to the point where it's too late and it's an unexpected cost for you, whether it's birds, whether it's roof, get a proactive plan rolling. And so I'll just push that as my last comment. Okay cool, sounds good yeah.
Speaker 2:Thanks for joining us. Hey, I appreciate you guys.
Speaker 3:Great time yeah yeah, thanks so much for having me on.
Speaker 2:We've got some new stuff coming up and it's funny that you mentioned, you know, getting free inspections and stuff. We're going to start getting into there to to kind of help you with peace of mind and some and some other stuff.
Speaker 1:So yeah.
Speaker 2:Ben, it's always a pleasure to see you, more than I ever need to.
Speaker 1:It is a pleasure to see me, isn't it? I wake up every morning saying the same thing. It's really not, but anyway.
Speaker 2:Hey, thanks for joining us on this episode and we'll see you again real soon. All right, thanks, thanks, guys.
